6464 2006-01-10 01:13:56 -0800 Unclickable cite reference 2009-03-29 07:47:41 -0700 1 1 1 Unclassified WebKit CSS 420+ Mac OS X 10.4 NEW http://blog.empyree.org/?873-flash-pour-ceux-qui-n-ont-rien-dire P3 Enhancement --- 1 david webkit-unassigned emacemac7 ian nickshanks oldest_to_newest 28119 0 david 2006-01-10 01:13:56 -0800 cite attibute, albeit perfectly valid, is not supported by browsers. - A common workaround is CSS autogeneration: http://www.holovaty.com/blog/archive/ 2002/12/20/0454 - But the end result is not clickable. Second workaround: it is possible to make it clickable with a special Opera XML rule (but it would only work with Opera, neither Mozilla nor WebCore). - Third workaround: duplicating information with a sentence explicitely stating where a quotation comes from, at the cost of losing some semantics. For the reason of these three workarounds, I assign a P3 severity status instead of P2. Some additionnal informations in French: http://blog.empyree.org/?282-des-cite-et-des-sites 28120 1 david 2006-01-10 01:15:51 -0800 (In reply to comment #0) a sort of testcase : http://blog.empyree.org/?873-flash-pour-ceux-qui-n-ont-rien-dire 28138 2 mjc 2006-01-10 07:26:54 -0800 occurs for me on r11976 28141 3 5598 joost 2006-01-10 07:59:58 -0800 Created attachment 5598 testcase 28142 4 joost 2006-01-10 08:03:00 -0800 added a testcase showing that this is indeed not clickable. But since it's not intended to as far as the spec is concerned ( http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/struct/text.html#h-9.2.1 ), i'm closing this as invalid. Neither FireFox or IE/Win make this a clickable link whatsoever. Maybe Ian Hickson can shed some light on what it's supposed to do :) 28176 5 david 2006-01-10 11:57:52 -0800 (In reply to comment #4) > added a testcase showing that this is indeed not clickable. But since it's not intended to as far as the spec > is concerned ( http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/struct/text.html#h-9.2.1 ), i'm closing this as invalid. Neither > FireFox or IE/Win make this a clickable link whatsoever. Maybe Ian Hickson can shed some light on what > it's supposed to do :) It is not supposed to be clickable, according to the specs. That is why I referenced the CSS trick as a *workaround*. The basic problem is that browser do not offer any way to go (or even to display) the value of the cite attribute). Hence the Opera workaround, by inserting a bit of xml. The bug is still OK: the first line is the bug ("cite attibute, albeit perfectly valid, is not supported by browsers.") The rest is imperfects worlarounds. I reopen the bug, please tell me if I should not do this. 28179 6 ap 2006-01-10 12:39:56 -0800 I would say: please open a new bug, asking for cite attribute support, ideally providing a testcase for it. This bug can be referenced for additional info on workarounds. 28180 7 ap 2006-01-10 13:17:21 -0800 Sorry, please disregard my previous comment. 28183 8 5601 ap 2006-01-10 14:11:26 -0800 Created attachment 5601 cite in blockquote testcase Do I understand it right that you are suggesting that the cite attribute should be rendered somehow, although no other browser does this? If so, do you have a suggestion about how it should be rendered (link? tooltip?), so that compatibility wouldn't be broken? Was this ever discussed before (perhaps, even in Mozilla bugzilla)? I guess, it should have been. 29292 9 david 2006-01-21 18:35:20 -0800 Hi, Well 1. making blockquote cite visible is all too easy http://www.holovaty.com/blog/archive/2002/12/20/0454/ 2. making them selectable is native with Opera, which is able to select auto-generated content 3. making it clickable is possible with a minor xml rule Opera provides q[cite], blockquote[cite] { -o-link: attr(cite); -o-link-source:current; cursor: pointer } I systematicaly use blockquote cite instead of a non-semantic dedicated paragraph. Alexey, do I answer your question? 29335 10 ap 2006-01-22 04:15:55 -0800 Thank you! Putting aside the general problem of non-selectable generated content, which is not specific to citations in any way, I see two issues here: 1) No built-in rendering for cite attribute. Firefox provides access to this attribute via a properties item in its context menu; Opera, Safari and WinIE don't seem to provide any access at all. 2) No support for Opera-only attributes "-o-link" and "-o-link-source". I'm confirming this bug (and changing severity to enchancement), although it will need to be separated in two if both these features are deemed necessary in WebKit. See also: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1995 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3662 29336 11 5834 ap 2006-01-22 04:16:41 -0800 Created attachment 5834 -o-link test case 29505 12 david 2006-01-22 17:42:05 -0800 Hi, You seem to be more knowledgeable than me on this topic. Could I ask you to report the two bugs? Or maybe just the first one, as I don't think Firefox should handle any proprietary feature BTW the description of these features is here <http://www.opera.com/docs/specs/> 29551 13 ap 2006-01-23 00:06:05 -0800 Me, knowledgeable? :) I've even misnamed those CSS properties as attributes, sorry for that. 31260 14 ap 2006-02-03 23:50:40 -0800 See also: <http://annevankesteren.nl/2006/01/cite>. 31273 15 david 2006-02-04 02:59:24 -0800 Reacted: http://annevankesteren.nl/2006/01/cite#comment-5148 34638 16 nickshanks 2007-01-16 04:28:07 -0800 I suggest making elements with a cite attribute (where that cite attribute is a URL) produce a contextual menu items such as ‘Open Citataion in Current Tab’ and ‘Open Citataion in New Tab’. When the mouse is hovering over a <q> or <b.q.> element, change the cursor to an arrow with menu beside it. You may also want to add a default style to html4.css for q[cite] and b.q.[cite] 34632 17 david 2007-01-16 09:26:30 -0800 (In reply to comment #10) > Putting aside the general problem of non-selectable generated content, which is > not specific to citations in any way, I see two issues here: > 1) No built-in rendering for cite attribute. Firefox provides access to this > attribute via a properties item in its context menu; Opera, Safari and WinIE > don't seem to provide any access at all. > 2) No support for Opera-only attributes "-o-link" and "-o-link-source". > > I'm confirming this bug (and changing severity to enchancement), although it > will need to be separated in two if both these features are deemed necessary in > WebKit. > > See also: > https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1995 > https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3662 > I have some new information related to the Opera technology; they are not using their own technology, but rather implemtenting a Y2K proposal called CLINK. You can check on Håkon’s very interesting (and legible) PHD: http://people.opera.com/howcome/2006/phd/#h-349 (In reply to comment #16) > I suggest making elements with a cite attribute (where that cite attribute is a > URL) produce a contextual menu items such as ‘Open Citation in Current Tab’ > and ‘Open Citation in New Tab’. > When the mouse is hovering over a <q> or <b.q.> element, change the cursor to > an arrow with menu beside it. > You may also want to add a default style to html4.css for q[cite] and > b.q.[cite] > I have to say I don't really like the Opera solution: they allow one link to be in another (a blockquote with a set cite attribute may still have another link inside, like <blockquote cite="foo.html">this is a <a href="bar.html">link</a></blockquote>. If you click on "link", you'll go to bar.html. If you click anywhere else on the blockquote, you will go at foo.html). In my humble opinion, this is both overkill and a bad idea. What we really want is to have a "source" link at the bottom of the quote; to make the whole quote clickable is confusing. The contextual menu idea is suboptimal, once again, IMHO (BTW, a contextual menu is available with Opera too). According to the principle of least surprise, the best appears to me to be a "generated area" (:after for the name, like content:"Click for the source"). Would we have to emulate the link behaviour (:hover {cursor:pointer}, text-decoration:underline…) or would it come free, the area being natively considered as a link? I favour the second way as more elegant, but I have no idea whether or not this is hard to do. I'm not sure I'm clear, please ask for any clarification (BTW, a preview feature would be great). 5598 2006-01-10 07:59:58 -0800 2006-01-10 07:59:58 -0800 testcase 6464-cite-not-clickable.html text/html 46 joost PGNpdGUgY2l0ZT0iaHR0cDovL3dlYmtpdC5vcmciPldlYktpdCE8L2NpdGU+Cg== 5601 2006-01-10 14:11:26 -0800 2006-01-10 14:11:26 -0800 cite in blockquote testcase 6464-cite-in-blockquote.html text/html 58 ap PGJsb2NrcXVvdGUgY2l0ZT0iaHR0cDovL3dlYmtpdC5vcmciPldlYktpdCE8L2Jsb2NrcXVvdGU+ Cg== 5834 2006-01-22 04:16:41 -0800 2006-01-22 04:16:41 -0800 -o-link test case o-link.html text/html 649 ap PGhlYWQ+CjxzdHlsZT4KcVtjaXRlXSwgYmxvY2txdW90ZVtjaXRlXSB7CiAgLW8tbGluazogYXR0 cihjaXRlKTsKICAtby1saW5rLXNvdXJjZTogY3VycmVudDsKfQpibG9ja3F1b3RlW2NpdGVdOmFm dGVyIHsKCWNvbnRlbnQ6ICJRdW90ZSBmcm9tOiAiIGF0dHIoY2l0ZSk7CglkaXNwbGF5OiBibG9j azsKCWJvcmRlci10b3A6IDFweCBzb2xpZCAjNjY5OwoJY29sb3I6ICM2Njk7CgltYXJnaW46IDFl bSAwIDA7CglwYWRkaW5nOiAuNWVtIDAgMDsKCWZvbnQtc2l6ZTogLjhlbTsKCWZvbnQtd2VpZ2h0 OiBib2xkOwp9Cjwvc3R5bGU+CjwvaGVhZD4KPGJvZHk+ClVzZSBhIGNvbnRleHQgbWVudSB0byBm b2xsb3cgdGhlIGxpbms6IDxxIGNpdGU9Imh0dHA6Ly9idWd6aWxsYS5vcGVuZGFyd2luLm9yZy9x dWlwcy5jZ2kiPkV2ZXJ5dGhpbmcgc2hvdWxkIGJlIG1hZGUgYXMgc2ltcGxlIGFzIHBvc3NpYmxl LCBidXQgbm90IHNpbXBsZXIuPC9xPgo8aHI+CjxibG9ja3F1b3RlIGNpdGU9Imh0dHA6Ly9idWd6 aWxsYS5vcGVuZGFyd2luLm9yZy9xdWlwcy5jZ2kiPkV2ZXJ5dGhpbmcgc2hvdWxkIGJlIG1hZGUg YXMgc2ltcGxlIGFzIHBvc3NpYmxlLCBidXQgbm90IHNpbXBsZXIuIC0gQWxiZXJ0IEVpbnN0ZWlu PC9ibG9ja3F1b3RlPgo8L2JvZHk+Cg==