170179 2017-03-28 09:08:23 -0700 VoiceOver does not announce a list for groups of links when list-style: none; 2023-01-09 08:29:01 -0800 1 1 1 Unclassified WebKit CSS Safari 10 All iOS 10 RESOLVED DUPLICATE 134187 P2 Normal --- 1 cornwell_izabella webkit-unassigned 92ethancampbell abdrahimbenrebia ap bobprokop brucemcgreggor1 jcraig johnsonlester545 markherryy monicajesvina nihag11639 sharpedward6 sohino8305 oldest_to_newest 1291908 0 cornwell_izabella 2017-03-28 09:08:23 -0700 VoiceOver on Safari 9.1.3 (MacPro) and 10.2.1 (iPAD/iPhone) does not announce a list for a groups of links when list-style is set to none } ul.navigation { list-style: none; padding: 0; } <ul class="navigation"> <li><a href="kitchen.html">Kitchen</a></li> <li><a href="bedbath.html">Bed &amp; Bath</a></li> <li><a href="dining.html">Fine Dining</a></li> <li><a href="lighting.html">Lighting</a></li> <li><a href="storage.html">Storage</a><li> </ul> url to test/verify: navigation tab menu at: https://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/after/home.html 1424283 1 jcraig 2018-05-16 02:51:09 -0700 This was a purposeful change due to rampant "list"-itis by web developers. In the same way WebKit differentiates layout tables from data tables, it now differentiates layout lists from data lists. VoiceOver users always used to file bugs that there were too many "start of list" "end of list" announcements on the Web. Customers seems much happier in the 3 years since this change went in. Basically, if you remove all default visible indication of the list, there is no indication to a sighted user or screen reader user that the content is a list. If you want to override this heuristic for accessibility, you can always add an explicit ARIA role="list". Read more about in bug 134187 or view the test case attachment https://bugs.webkit.org/attachment.cgi?id=233587 *** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of bug 134187 *** 1918566 10 bobprokop 2022-12-12 12:00:34 -0800 Sorry but this is an example of overreach by Safari development team. This line: 'This was a purposeful change due to rampant "list"-itis by web developers.' -- is all opinion. Nothing a browser manufacturer does should require obligatory use of aria. That breaks the first rule of aria. And the argument about tables in Chrome and FF is misleading. Developers have to add a role for it to be ignored. Those browsers do not consider a table to be presentation by default. 1924087 11 jcraig 2023-01-09 08:29:01 -0800 https://twitter.com/cookiecrook/status/1337226933822603270